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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 10 post(s) |
Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10858
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Posted - 2014.12.20 14:52:13 -
[1] - Quote
Dracvlad wrote:CCP Rise wrote:Just finished reading everything that was posted over night. Here's what I can update with at the moment:
Dscan immunity is staying. We understand a lot of the concerns raised, but for most of them you guys are doing a great job making strong counter-arguments and I think it will be very interesting to see how this mechanic plays out on TQ. I want to put together a lengthier post soon with more explanation for this mechanic and why we feel comfortable with it, but you will have to wait a bit longer for that.
What strong counter arguments, they are all chaff type HTFU cheer-leading or weak arguments, I was enticed back by the jump changes and the slight tilt towards role playing, but the D-scan immunity makes it certain death. I am not sure I will wait for your explanation before hitting the de-sub button, in fact damn it I am de-subbing now and I will put this as my reason. Its ill thought out and makes it even easier for the easy gank crowd, WTF are you doing!
This might come a shock to the likes of you, but you aren't the only playerbase in EVE.
These changes are beyond amazing.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10859
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 15:19:46 -
[2] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote: You like fighting larger gangs outnumbered by using nano fits? Good luck, you are web'd into the ground. You like fighting larger gangs outnumbered by using Remote Reps and strong tanks? Good luck, you are neuted and jammed.
Honestly? Good. Both of those two things are incredibly no-fun for the opponent, they lead to binary fights in which you either have what you need to win or you just whelp helplessly.
And you're crying the death of those things... because counterplay is actually possible now against either of them.
I hate to tell you this, but the sky is not falling just because recons aren't unviable.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10860
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 15:36:55 -
[3] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote: I hate to tell you this, but just because you don't understand the counters for various setups doesn't mean others don't.
And I don't think you have a clue what I was talking about.
Against a kite fleet, you either have the counter or you just don't take the fight. And it requires a very specific fleet comp to do so.
That crowds out low skillpoint players(most notably newbies), and less established groups who can't manage the counter. Against reps, it's even worse since any damage you might do while fighting is erased.
Those two comps you described crowd out potential for taking fights, since it's so binary. You either have it or you shouldn't take the fight in the first place. They are bad things.
Quote: This change makes Combat recons a bit more than viable, it makes them OP in a massive way.
How? By making them less than paper thin tank? That's been overdue for a long time. But what you really mean is that you can't see them beforehand, so you can take the one sided fight in your binary fleet comp.
You want absolute certainty.
Too damn bad.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10860
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 15:50:59 -
[4] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote: Actually, their EWAR is balanced by their paper thin tanks.
Or, it was, before the last few ewar nerfs anyway. They are the intended long range counter to reps afterall, but somehow they have a third of their hitpoints or less.
Quote: By improving their tanks they will already find their way into most fleets of 8 or more.
Good. Having an entire ship class that was useless for anything but the training model for a T3 is a bad thing.
Quote: Adding DSCAN immunity makes them so ridiculously usefull in solo/micro gang that their proliferation will wipe out many other comps (people just won't fly them).
If those fleet comps are as toxic as kiting has become in this game, good.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10860
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 15:57:15 -
[5] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Another advocate of the changes to recon dscanning. Another guy who has barely ever pvp'd.
I'm pretty open about this character basically being a forum alt for the longest time. Besides, you don't get on killmails as logi, which is what Kaarous has been for a while now until I joined Devils.
But hey, keep playing the killboard game like it means anything.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10863
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Posted - 2014.12.20 17:33:58 -
[6] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Impling that recons are a panacea for low sp toons to escape the tedium of being killed by kiters is so dumb im amazed you said it since recons are not well known for their low sp demands.
Good thing I didn't actually say that. What I said was that if the Chicken Littles are correct and somehow Recons not being unviable somehow ruins kiting, that it's not a bad thing because kiting chokes out the little guy, and discourages people from taking fights.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10864
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 17:40:56 -
[7] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote: Impling that recons are a panacea for low sp toons to escape the tedium of being killed by kiters is so dumb im amazed you said it since recons are not well known for their low sp demands.
Good thing I didn't actually say that. What I said was that if the Chicken Littles are correct and somehow Recons not being unviable somehow ruins kiting, that it's not a bad thing because kiting chokes out the little guy, and discourages people from taking fights. But recons that can warp in to a plex and create a 180km killzone dont kill new guys?, more than that they come with far less warning. Pretty sure this is a magnification of your objection to kiting so ill assume you agree with me about ninja recons.
What on earth is wrong with being hunted? That's a great thing, it will let people kill the freaking faction warfare farmers for once since their d-scan bots won't detect combat recons.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10864
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 17:43:31 -
[8] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: It's just a cop out because the argument I made was too strong and he/she has run out of ammunition due to his/her obvious lack of game knowledge.
If subbing another account is what you call "adapting" then I'll see you in No Man's Sky.
I personally suggest Elite Dangerous instead.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10864
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 17:45:59 -
[9] - Quote
Besides, how in the name of Zeus does this "kill solo"?
It buffs solo a fair bit, since you can hunt people wtih Combat Recons now, with some actual potency. Hunting ratters for example just got a lot easier, ditto hunting wormhole bears.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10864
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 17:51:19 -
[10] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Just like people complaining about incarna were just pleading for ccp to not add value to the game.
What? Protesting against pay to win/flushing years of dev time on a tech demo has nothing whatsoever to do with ship rebalancing.
Totally incomparable things.
Quote: The problem is that you seem to want to give feedback on other peoples feedback which makes you come off as a fan boy.
Telling you that the sky isn't falling doesn't exactly qualify anyone as a fanboy. In fact, calling someone a "fanboy" is pretty much the biggest copout that exists in contemporary forum discourse. It's basically saying "I can't stand disagreement so I want to apply a negative label to try and silence them", and it's ******* pathetic.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10864
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 17:54:11 -
[11] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Its a hell of a trade off to kill a few 300k isk stabbed farmers. The fact that is your aspiration says quite a lot.
Nothing of value is being lost, and my range of targets increases considerably. What's not to like?
And yes, I like killing bots, it's why I donate to CODE.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10864
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 17:57:37 -
[12] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: It doesn't kill it, but it's definitely one more coolbro trap I'm going to have to endure, which there are already too many of (carrier drone asist, offgrid links on solo garmurs [as if they needed it], ect.), which is insanely frustrating.
Two of those things almost certainly should not exist.
Viable recons almost certainly should.
Quote: The main problem is if I warp into a plex thinking I'm getting a fairly even fight, there's no course of action I can take against there being an dscan immune recon on the inside of said plex.
There are several. You just reject them because you think refusing to play an MMO with other people somehow makes you better than other people.
Quote: Furthermore if I'm in a plex and someone warps in on me, theres no warning of the dscan immune recon warping in.
See the above.
Quote: Honestly there's just no downside or balancing point.
Yeah, actually there is. It's just "cloak lite", giving you similar functionality while in warp but not on grid. The only major benefit is in fitting, which really doesn't mean much since most ships that fit cloaks do so with a fitting bonus anyway.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10866
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:13:12 -
[13] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: I do actually fly in gangs, albeit small gangs. The main reason I fly solo or in small gangs is because I am looking for a challenge. I however like to find challenges where my ability as a PvPer can surmount numbers, however with improper intel, and no way for me or my small gang to gain intel (aside from yet again one of us having a probing alt or *shudders* BEING the probing alt) it just gives another unneeded advantage to all the coolbros who want to pay to win. Dscan immunity not having some features of the covert cloak is not a downside. It is merely a(n arguably) lesser upside with no downside.
If you fly in gangs then there is no problem. Your scout should have probes and a cloak anyway. Probes negate it's distance advantage, and having eyes on grid with a cloak shows you what's on grid waiting for you. Probes literally take seconds to get the same intel you would have gotten out of d-scan.
So why all the "if you make me get another account I'll unsub and go play something else"?
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10866
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:24:15 -
[14] - Quote
maCH'EttE wrote: I swear you must fly in large gangs, cuz your repetitive lip keeps saying, probes, probes, scouts, probes, probe scout, scout with combat probes, combat probes. you must not have a clue on how small gangs or solo combat works. Some people dont have the luxory of flying in 20+ gangs with links/sout/logi/ecm. wait let me guess, get a cloaky scout with probes.
Devils usually flies less than a dozen people. In our "stream snipe" of Lazarus Telraven the other day, we flew a smaller handful of pilots.
We somehow manage to have scouts and eyes where we need them with little trouble.
But all of your "I shouldn't have to" just exposes how fat and comfortable you've gotten with d-scan providing such perfect intel. Something comes along that bypasses that otherwise perfect trick, and you lot lose your freaking minds.
What is wrong with your attitude? All I can think of for these ships is how much fun I will have hunting people in a Curse.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10866
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:28:47 -
[15] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: Something comes along that bypasses that WITH NO DOWNSIDE and takes the place of its counterpart in every situation where I see it used (in lowsec) when said counterpart was already the lesser used of the two.
With the slight exception of cloak delay, a cov ops cloak is still the superior of the two mechanics.
But let's not even pretend that you're here trying to look out for the cloaked recons. You're here to protect your niche from something that you think might rattle it some, simple as that.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10866
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:36:57 -
[16] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote:And thus all constructive conversation inevitably devolves into coolbros who plan on paying to win with said change downplaying everyone else's opinion because they wont "man up and plex another account" or "magically train all their newbros to scan" or "miraculously make low sec pvpers want to be the dedicated scanner for their fleet".
First of all, and coming from me it's especially damning, that is a massive run-on sentence.
Secondly, you seem to act like scouts are some big gigantic unreasonable weight around your neck or something.
Thirdly, what in the Burning Hells is a "coolbro", anyway?
Quote: And here I was trying to look at how this will realistically effect the portion of the game that I know. Silly me, I thought we were stating opinions here but I was mistaken. We're clearly just picking apart others opinions without having any constructive input of our own.
My bad.
I have constructive input.
CCP Rise, these are excellent changes, please do not bow to pressure from groups who are trying to argue their own self interest coming before proper ship balancing.
The end.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10866
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:44:38 -
[17] - Quote
Kmelx, I stopped reading when you made a claim that e-honor should come before ship balancing.
Do you have a TL;DR for that post?
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10867
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:51:07 -
[18] - Quote
Lug Muad'Dib wrote:All thing in eve need drawback, fast locking undetectable recon is no way, or solo and small gang will just never fight outside of novice and small plex, good luck to hunt people here with your recon... Kaarous Aldurald wrote: kiting chokes out the little guy, and discourages people from taking fights.
Learn basic gameplay mechanic before posting perhaps ?
So you'd totally engage a Zealot fleet with a bunch of Thoraxes?
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10867
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 18:52:28 -
[19] - Quote
Kmelx wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Kmelx, I stopped reading when you made a claim that e-honor should come before ship balancing.
Do you have a TL;DR for that post? Sure TLDR: Your highsec ganker PVP viewpoint is worthless to the discussion of the effect this change will have on low and null sec solo and small gang PVP.
And meanwhile, the opinions of people who pound their fist on the table screaming about how d-scan should be perfect so they never have to use scouts... are worthless in their entirety.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10867
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 19:02:28 -
[20] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: You're arguing for this so that you can overabuse the very imbalances that we're trying to discuss, discrediting our valid concerns, while offering absolutely no constructive counter-point by which we can take you seriously and actually have a debate.
No, I'm arguing for this because I actually want to fly these ships. They are cool as hell, and they've been pretty badly unviable for a long damned time now.
Changes that improve them to be useful and viable are a positive. Being off of d-scan is unique, useful, and opens up a whole new dimension of combat in the game.
And I truly don't care if said changes upset your little birdcage.
You first.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10867
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 19:06:26 -
[21] - Quote
TrouserDeagle wrote:so people are saying to 'just use probes'.
how do I fit an expanded probe launcher to my thorax?
I refuse to believe that Shadow Cartel of all people are unaware of what scouts are, and how to make good use of them.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10869
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 19:22:38 -
[22] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: Honestly, you're playing in a smaller birdcage than I am and acting like the entire game should revolve around you wanting to fly a different ship. You want to fly a new ship? Do something new. That's what I did.
Says the guy arguing that his desire to not have scouts in his fleet should dictate game balance?
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10872
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 19:55:08 -
[23] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: yet again, not constructive.
How is that? I'm just countering your assertions.
Claiming that the changes are bad because you can't be asked to bring probes is what's really not constructive here.
Quote:We use scouts all the time, but all but requiring a probe launcher definitely hurts the folks who like to (or have to because newbros) fly small frig/dessy gangs and do not have the resources to sub an alt for that sole purpose.
Plenty of people make it work. Your failings don't reflect on ship balance.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10875
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 20:24:37 -
[24] - Quote
hellokittyonline wrote: If they were changing something that ruined a character you had been training for years I would say otherwise, that would be where your opinion should come into consideration. This is not one of those scenarios.
And this right here is why your opinion is irrelevant.
It's just based on blatant selfishness.
According to what you just said, a capital ship pilot holding onto his golden goose should have priority in balance discussions just because he's sunk a lot of time into it. Nevermind that carriers are broken, Titans were broken, and the jump range changes went through afterall, despite the objections of people who had been "training for years".
**** no. And if you can't see how incredibly bad that is, then you're blind.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 21:59:57 -
[25] - Quote
Sabrina Scatterbrain wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:TrouserDeagle wrote:so people are saying to 'just use probes'.
how do I fit an expanded probe launcher to my thorax? I refuse to believe that Shadow Cartel of all people are unaware of what scouts are, and how to make good use of them. Yep, because you can get anyone, especially dumb new guys, to sit around with dycke in hand while you enjoy your game, or do you mean spend more money on another account... Either way your statement sucks nuts.
So, either my current and my previous corp are some of the best players in the game... or just using a freaking scout is not as hard as you make it out to be.
Plenty of people get it done without breaking their banks or abusing their newbies.
Idk what your problem is.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 22:11:16 -
[26] - Quote
Sabrina Scatterbrain wrote:The end result of Dscan buggery will be that wormhole space is dead and current blob mechanics will shift to Recon blobs, good job CCP, good job.
Please explain how anybody but carebear farmers would be hurt by this in wormholes. Especially seeing as how wormholers often fly ships that will reduce a solo recon to dust without much trouble, even after an EHP buff.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 22:27:44 -
[27] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Well it certainly isnt the first one and the second is hard if you are a solo or micro gang pvper
Which, I am. And I'm telling you, it's not hard.
Quote: it isnt about bank for some people, its about the quality of the game.
Except that the person I was addressing summed it up as "either you abuse your newbies by making them do it, or you pay for an extra account", which is quite simply not the case. That's the only false dichotomy here.
Quote: We get it, you are a blobbing f1 monkey fighting in large groups where a few recons isnt really gonna be a game changer.
I really don't think you do get it, to be honest I think you're just conjuring things to attack since you don't have anything else to do. I plan on using these. I will be buying several Curses the moment I get on my home computer and boot up my client.
Quote: Just because it makes no difference to you doesnt mean it doesnt have the potential to decimate long standing solo and micro gang pvp in this game.
And just because you don't like it doesn't mean it's not a positive change. This is pretty much the lowsec version of the jump range nerfs. People bawled about those far louder than you lot have about this, and it still went through. And it turns out it was for the better.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 22:51:25 -
[28] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:You my friend are an f1 monkey. Post with your main if you want any credibility.
Stop making lame appeals to credentials, and let your arguments stand on their own.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:06:41 -
[29] - Quote
I took the liberty of ringing for the ISDs, since your dogged insistence on attacking me because you lack the wherewithal to attack my arguments has constituted a pretty huge derailing of the thread at this point.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:09:26 -
[30] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: You have no argument
That's not true. I approve of the changes being made, and I find the assertion that the sky is falling as a result of them to be laughable, wildly off base, and alarmist at best.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:12:59 -
[31] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Another strawman. I didnt say anything about sky or falling.
Talk about obtuse...
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:16:07 -
[32] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote: Another strawman. I didnt say anything about sky or falling.
Talk about obtuse... I think i covered that in an edit. If anyone is alarmist its you thinking that people disagreeing with a core mechanic change is 'laughable'.
That's not alarmist, by literally every definition. That's dismissive, and rightly so, because the people wetting their pants about this are worthy of being laughed at.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:21:26 -
[33] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Thinking a change is a bad idea and pointing out reasons and scenarios why isnt 'wetting their pants'.
There is very little reasoning going on, just a whole lot of "don't touch my niche!" and "wormholes will die!" and "How dare you make me have to use scouts!".
I have not seen one legitimate post against the changes, and that includes yours, since all you've done is cry about my killboard and my use of an alt. You've offered nothing, just pointless quibbling.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:25:46 -
[34] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote: Thinking a change is a bad idea and pointing out reasons and scenarios why isnt 'wetting their pants'.
There is very little reasoning going on, just a whole lot of "don't touch my niche!" and "wormholes will die!" and "How dare you make me have to use scouts!". I have not seen one legitimate post against the changes, and that includes yours, since all you've done is cry about my killboard and my use of an alt. You've offered nothing, just pointless quibbling. Talk about obtuse. Its clear to me that you are purposefully ignorant to what me and a good proportion of people have said in this thread. Your continued participation as a 'dscan immunity apologist' is obvious. And like any good fundamentalist, you will not hear anything anyone says as exemplified by this posting.
What's missing from the above is any form of actual argument against the changes, just more personal attacks against me for daring to like these changes.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:30:29 -
[35] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote: Objections have been repeated hundreds of times in this thread.
And, as has been mentioned, they are ragey, whiny rants without substance, and most of them are tacitly happy with the shape they are in now as largely worthless.
And you still refuse to actually address the topic.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
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Posted - 2014.12.20 23:36:24 -
[36] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:The topic has been addressed. Points have been raised.
Like what? Nevermind that all of them are wrong, but go ahead and give me an example, if one actually exists.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:42:09 -
[37] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Crosi Wesdo wrote:The topic has been addressed. Points have been raised.
Like what? Nevermind that all of them are wrong, but go ahead and give me an example, if one actually exists. You really are well beyond the bounds now my friend. You have exposed your true purpose to simply troll.
I'm asking you to get on topic, cease personally attacking me (which is the first thing you did when you quoted any of my posts, for that matter) and actually address the topic with whatever theoretically legitimate arguments that you claim are already here.
And you refuse.
But somehow that makes me the troll.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:52:40 -
[38] - Quote
Zemfadel wrote:So, these changes sound great to me but I can see how they could be problematic. Especially in wh space where ships that are designed to be very heavy tackle will now be undetectable until they land on top of you...
Couldn't you do that with a cloaked T3 anyway?
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.20 23:55:48 -
[39] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote:Kaarous Aldurald wrote:Zemfadel wrote:So, these changes sound great to me but I can see how they could be problematic. Especially in wh space where ships that are designed to be very heavy tackle will now be undetectable until they land on top of you... Couldn't you do that with a cloaked T3 anyway? Nope, will show on DSCAN when it comes through the hole.
For about five seconds, I guess. But that's too short of a time window to see without using a d-scan bot anyway.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10877
|
Posted - 2014.12.21 00:00:32 -
[40] - Quote
Thanatos Marathon wrote: rofl, its called clicking your mouse button.
Well, that's what you say, but it's a pretty big coincidence if you can be clicking d-scan literally constantly and spot the guy when he randomly pops in. I honestly doubt that you do that literally once a second, every second. If so I'd like to see your CTS surgery scars, lol.
Now, I would easily believe that wormholers use d-scan bots, however. I've known that to be a thing for a long time, and I suspect having that taken away from them is a large portion of why some are so upset about this.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10882
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Posted - 2014.12.21 00:59:04 -
[41] - Quote
Crosi Wesdo wrote:An area of effect doomsday really excels at roflstomping everything on grid. Doesnt mean its balanced or even a good idea.
It's also an order of magnitude's difference to what is being discussed here. Gross exaggeration does not help your case.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10932
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Posted - 2014.12.24 14:59:03 -
[42] - Quote
I'm disappointed in the rollback of hitpoints.
Hitpoints was the major thing these ships needed, as being squishy was keeping them from seeing use at almost any scale of combat.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10942
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Posted - 2014.12.24 22:39:22 -
[43] - Quote
h3llra1z3r3 Arkaral wrote: No it isn't, not everybody has multiple accounts and multiple alts and nor should they be forced into it.
Nor should it be the sole point of balancing, either. Fun and innovative mechanics should not be held back merely because some people object to non-solo activities.
Quote: The game mechanics should at least be viable for a single character to play and participate above just being there to get ganked.
Why? Last time I checked, this was a multiplayer game. Choosing to handicap yourself should not merit additional consideration when it comes to game balance.
Quote: In contrast to that, the attacker/hunter must also use the tools at his disposal to find and attack the victim. But he must use these tools in a way that does not give him away and does not get him killed by other hunters doing the same.
Absolutely none of which aren't 100% mitigated by correct use of d-scan.
That's the point of this. To make it so there are more dimensions to this besides "Are they using d-scan or not?" Right now it's really binary, and that is a bad thing.
Quote: So, the only people in favour of this mechanic are those that are already doing the ganking. So we are clear, I think ganking is for those that still miss their mouth when they try to eat, but regardless of my thoughts on it everybody should be able to participate, even the special kids. I just think they heave it easy enough as it is.[ /b]
Yeah, somehow I have my doubts as to your impartiality here. Just sayin'.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10943
|
Posted - 2014.12.25 00:56:23 -
[44] - Quote
You screwed up those quotes right royal.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10943
|
Posted - 2014.12.25 01:09:40 -
[45] - Quote
h3llra1z3r3 Arkaral wrote: That statement has nothing to do with being impartial. I am however impartial to changes being made.
No you are not. You have explicitly said that you are against d-scan immunity because it impacts positively on something you don't like.
That's about as far from impartial as it's possible to be.
Quote: The funny thing is I think we all agree that recons need to be updated, I just see gankers so blinded with joy at the change that they can't see or refuse to look at the picture as a whole. Yes Dscan immunity could be cool, but it's not the buff recons need, its just a rushed change under the guise of recon balancing.
Every little bit helps, since they're damned determined to not give them workable hitpoint levels. You seem to be under the assumption that the hitpoint boost would have happened without the d-scan immunity, and you're mistaken.
Quote:Also if you are so partial to team activities or just roaming with your 5 alts, then keep dscan immunity and remove combat recons damage dealing potential. So then at least you have an ewar tackle boat that has some tank while you get your other five characters into the WH. Seems like a pretty fair trade of to me.
Quit bolding for emphasis on entire paragraphs, it's obnoxious.
And no, I'll take the d-scan immunity with a viable dps platform, thanks. Nevermind that I don't run five alts, it's two at most.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10943
|
Posted - 2014.12.25 01:54:36 -
[46] - Quote
h3llra1z3r3 Arkaral wrote:Being impartial also means against imbalance.
And d-scan is unbalanced. It's getting a counter now.
Quote: Also, I never said I don't like gankers
Let's not be obtuse.
Quote: Every little bit does help. The key word there would be little. Can you point me in the direction to where I made this assumption?
The part where you called it the wrong buff for recons. You seem to think that if this goes away that they will get the hitpoint buff. And that is not the case.
And since it's not the case, I am going to try and live with what we get.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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Kaarous Aldurald
Lords.Of.Midnight The Devil's Warrior Alliance
10944
|
Posted - 2014.12.25 03:00:50 -
[47] - Quote
I would ask you why you're in a wormhole as a casual, solo player without anyone to help you.
It's one of EVE's most effort intensive activities.
"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."
One of ours, ten of theirs.
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